Show Notes

As Perceptions Shift, Realities Transform; It Starts With A Conversation

A conversation that epitomizes the transformative power of dialogue. For this DTH conversation I am joined by two remarkable individuals, absolute icons in the de-radicalization space,  men I am honored to call friends. Today I am joined by Daryl Davis and Jeff Schoep, whose initial encounter sparked a journey of de-radicalization and unexpected connection.

Their conversation explores the profound impact of genuine dialogue on shifting perceptions and fostering understanding. We'll uncover the organic nature of human connection and the ripple effect of positive change that emanates from it.

At the heart of our discussion lies the theme of de-radicalization. We'll delve a bit into Jeff's journey, guided by the unwavering support and insight of Daryl Davis. Their exchange highlights the importance of personal stories and vulnerability in challenging preconceived notions and reshaping beliefs.

But this isn't just about individual transformation. We'll examine how ongoing conversations and relationships play a pivotal role in changing not only individuals but entire communities. As perceptions shift, realities transform, creating a domino effect of positive change.

Through their dialogue, Daryl and Jeff illuminate the power of conversation in bridging divides and dismantling barriers. Perception shapes reality, and by altering someone's perception, we have the power to change their reality.

So, join us my friends as we journey through the depths of human connection, exploring the profound impact of unexpected encounters, genuine dialogue, and the relentless pursuit of understanding.


  • The organic nature of human connection and the impact of unexpected encounters.
  • The role of Daryl Davis in Jeff Scoop's de-radicalization journey.
  • The impact of genuine conversation on shifting perspectives and breaking down barriers. Perception shapes reality, and altering someone's perception can change their reality.
  • Personal stories and vulnerability have the power to challenge preconceived notions and change perspectives.
  • Ongoing conversations and relationships play a crucial role in changing people's attitudes and beliefs.
  • Positive change has a ripple effect, impacting not only individuals but also communities and society at large.


00:00 DTH Introduction

01:32 Guest Introduction and show summary

03:22 Welcome Daryl Davis & Jeff Schoep

06:24 Initial Encounters and Deradicalization Journey

16:09 The Organic Nature of Human Connection

26:01 The Power of Perception and Personal Stories

34:31 The Process of Deradicalization

42:07 The Ripple Effect of Positive Change

Who is Daryl Davis?

Chicago native Daryl Davis graduated from Howard University with a degree in Jazz.  As a pianist, vocalist and guitarist, he has played all over the world with legends like Chuck Barry and Little Richard. 

But it's what Daryl does in his free time that sets him apart. To find the answer to his question, "How can you hate me when you don't even know me?" Daryl meets and builds relationships with members of the Ku Klux Klan. 

As a race relations expert Dr. Daryl Davis has received numerous awards and high acclaim for his book Klan-Destine Relationships and his award-winning film documentary Accidental Courtesy. He is the first Black author to write a book on the Ku Klux Klan based upon in-person interviews and personal encounters.

His ability to get racists to renounce their ideology has sent Daryl to travel all over the United States and the world to share his methodology. 

Connect with Daryl Davis online: 

Website: https://www.daryldavis.com/


Twitter (X): @RealDarylDavis


Who is Jeff Schoep?

From leading America’s largest neo-Nazi group to becoming a beacon of hope, Jeff Schoep’s journey is a seismic shift that ignites conversations and reshapes lives. His voice, once a weapon of hate, now resounds with redemption, echoing in powerful keynote talks, workshops, and encounters that leave indelible marks. 

Once America’s most notorious neo-Nazi, now a consultant for the Simon Wiesenthal Center and an inspirational speaker for Conscious Campus, Jeff Schoep tirelessly holds keynote talks, lectures, and workshops from his unique vantage point. Jeff Schoep is the Founder and President of BeyondBarriersUSA.org.

Connect with Jeff Schoep online: 

Twitter (X): @schoepjeff

LinkedIn: jeff-schoep-126472213

Facebook: jeffschoepofficial

Instagram: jeff_schoep

What have you done today to make your life a better life? What have you done today to make the world a better place? The world is a better place if we are better people. That begins with each of us as individuals. Be kind to one another. Be grateful for everything you’ve got. Make each and every day the day that you want it to be!

Please follow The Derate The Hate podcast on:

Facebook, Instagram, Twitter(X) , YouTube

Subscribe to us wherever you enjoy your audio or directly from our site. Please leave us a rating and feedback on Apple podcasts or other platforms. Not on social media? You can share your thoughts or request Wilk for a speaking engagement on our site’s contact page: DerateTheHate.com/Contact

If you would like to support the show, you’re welcome to DONATE or shop Amazon by going through our Support Us page and I’ll earn through qualifying purchases at no extra cost to you.

I look forward to hearing from you!

Comments & Upvotes